Inevitably the question of identity arises when you look in on a collaborative process from outside. Who is doing what and with whom? In the collaborative process egos are suppressed but that is not always possible or even desirable. Sometimes what is required is a cooperative team. The [ANTIplonk] way of dealing with some of this is to negotiate a formula and express it in numbers. It may not be perfect but we'll keep on working on it so that we can get to where we wish to go.